An Interested Spectator Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 I was having a few beers with an old friend of mine, who i have not seen for some time, the other night. Both of us have a keen intrest in the countryside and farming, but neither of us have ever worked in the industry. As the evening went on and the empties stacked up we got around to talking about farming locally, (Somerset). We came to a conclusion that we could not understand why any livestock farmer would not be using contractors for field work, particulary forage cropping. The cost of labour and machinary is simply too high. A contractor bears all the purchase costs and machinary depreication values. Modern kit can clear a whole farm in a couple of days so minimal disruption and, proberly different to the situation in the past, so many people are now in the contracting game if one lets you down there is always someone else happy to take his place. This leaves the farmer to concentrate fully time of his stock, which at the end of the day is what the business is about. The only way we could see it being worth while for a farmer to do his own harvesting would be if he had family who are able help out, and running older machinary. Modern self loading wagons and big balers are another option, but you still need a 200hp tractor and the cost of the other kit on top of that, and it still means the farmer is away from his stock for large blocks of time. So a drunken thumbs up for contractors. Any one want to agree or disagree ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 Farmers take operations in house where they are weather or time critical and don't have a decent contractor they can rely on. We only grow 150 acres of cereals for instance, but we have our own combine. If you can get the sums to stack up then doing things like foraging yourself reduces dependance on other people. Your kit should be less likely to break down if well maintained [in theory] than a contractors because you're doing less acreage. So it makes sense to do it. If your kit is clapped out then a contractor is going to be more reliable and cheaper in the long run. It's horses for courses. Some of us just like doing certain jobs and not others! We get a contractor in for combination drilling and spraying. Everything else we do ourselves, and combining is something we look forward to all year! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nashmach Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 I think Simon sums it up - we only have a small operation yet do most of our work apart from mowing, combining, baling, wrapping, hedge cutting and muck and lime spreading. We feel we can do it a lot cheaper running older smaller and well maintained equipment that we try to buy at fair prices and I guess overall our true depreciation is actually negative - its pretty much horses for courses though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM190 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 I know locally that in Silage 07 good Contractors were in very high demand and they couldn't get all the work done. I know a farmer whos silage went in 4 weeks later than it should have because he couldn't get anyone to put it in. \ \ Theres not very many farmers that do run older machinery and do most of the work themselves now around me, mostly contractors ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabh7840 Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 thers not many farmers now in n.ireland anaway that tackle the job of cutting their own silage, but some people say that in 10 years time itl be like it was 30 years ago, farmers will cut their own silage because the slurry ban gives contractors very limited income over the winter and with a harvester or whatever sitting needing paid off it aint that good. the price of red diesel wont help either plus the fact that they cant get drivers, or ones that can drive anaway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
civilpek Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 thers not many farmers now in n.ireland anaway that tackle the job of cutting their own silage, but some people say that in 10 years time itl be like it was 30 years ago, farmers will cut their own silage because the slurry ban gives contractors very limited income over the winter and with a harvester or whatever sitting needing paid off it aint that good. the price of red diesel wont help either plus the fact that they cant get drivers, or ones that can drive anaway! did you see primetime last night, if i was a contractor up north id be crossing the border for my diesel thats for sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
massey man Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 and using half a tank of it geting back from the south to the yard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
civilpek Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 and using half a tank of it geting back from the south to the yard well get it dlivered thenj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fendt-man-matty Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 personally i would love to go into contracting, but i wouldnt start off with silage. i would like to start off with one tractor doing ploughing, slurry/muck, hedge cutting and something else, then maybe start buying in more tractors and possibly start silage \ i would go to college to do engineering then work for contractors and get as mucgh experience as possible, then buy a tractor and all..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakescot Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 someone remind me to come back to this when I have more time please.............a cautionary tale young matty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fendt-man-matty Posted December 18, 2007 Share Posted December 18, 2007 ano what your gonna say, ''DONT DO IT MATTY YOU OVIOUSLY DONT HAVE A CLUE'', well we have to dream sometimes :'( :'( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Interested Spectator Posted December 18, 2007 Author Share Posted December 18, 2007 As per the above comments re cautionary tales for people entering contracting. I do know of several people who have tried and failed. I also do know of a couple of people who have made it work, but it has to be said the only way they made it work was by being specialists in doing work for stables and small holders. I also know both had to branch out into equipment hire as well to make equipment pay for itself. I admit this was in Surrey which is the horse capital of the UK, and you have to adapt to the work prevelent in your area but if i was a young man starting out in this business this is the way i would look at starting off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich.new holland Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 we do everything our selfs and the only time we have got a contractor in is when our baler broke on a bank holiday ,as we do contracting on a small scale doing about an extra 300-350 acres of baling and wrapping but i would like to start for a bigger contractor like you matty but ive always been told "that if you dont go up to the starting line ,you dont have the change to win" thats what my grandfather used to say people have told me not to go into contracting as long hours ,not good pay etc but i want to go into it for the exprience not the money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 A friend of mine started contracting when he left school with an IH 674 from a farm sale. Nearly 10 years down the road and he now runs a new MF 6480, a 6180 trailed chopper, couple of nice trailers, pottinger mower, plough, hedgetrimmer, and various other odds and sods. I don't know the precise extent of his fleet these days as the last time I saw him was at his wedding. And that was probably the last time his wife saw him too! He works all the hours that he can, mostly because he loves what he does. If you can start small then a smart little business can still be built. To get you thinking this was how his tractor fleet has evolved. He borrowed around a thousand pounds for his first tractor and went out as tractor and driver helping local farms, ours being one, tedding, trailering etc. Approx dates & tractors: 1996/8 - IH 674 1998/9 - MF 590 2wd 1999/01 - MF 690 2001/03 - MF 3080 2003/05 - MF 6180 + MF 699 2005/07 - MF 6280 + MF 3080 2007/ - MF 6480 [which he turned up at his wedding on] + MF 6180 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james f Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 I'd say if you're going to go into contracting its best to find a niche, maybe doing some new service like crimping. Finding a viable niche like that is easier said than done I know, and its a risk to invest in a machine for a job that might just be a fad, but for example, when baled silage became popular first anyone that bought a wrapper early on was able to sew up the market and establish a customer base without having to go out and compete with every tom **** and harry, the same with slurry agitation when slatted tanks became popular. I know several lads who tried hedgecutting and couldn't make it work, mostly because of the cost of insurance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fendt-man-matty Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 has anyone ever thought of going round farms with a diet feeder in winter??? would it work?? so would this yearly cycle keep the money coming in??? by the way these are only ideas..... january-diet feeding, bedding, fencing febuary-same, maybe ploughing, muck sreading march-same again, muck speading, ploughing april-more fencing, slurry for silage may-slurry after silage has been brought in june-a wee bit of slurry, maybe hay making july-fencing and other duties and helping out with harvest august- putting out muck september- ploughing, other duties october-last of slurry, start diet feeding november-diet feeding and bedding december-same well if this was possible, would this keep you going??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new holland driver Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 were you going to spread your sullry cattle work at worth it smash your tractor up and little money well thats what i ahve learnt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
civilpek Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 were you going to spread your sullry cattle work at worth it smash your tractor up and little money well thats what i ahve learnt sorry but i havent a clue what you said there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich.new holland Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 same here, and i thought my sentences didnt make sense :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james f Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 I think he means "Where are you going to spread your slurry? Cattle work aint worth it, you smash your tractor up and make little money. Well that's what I have learned" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nashmach Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 James you are a Norfolk translator now :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james f Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 James you are a Norfolk translator now :D Just one of my many talents : Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerrabbit Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 As most of you already probably know, I live on Dartmoor and contracting has always had a big part to play here as the farms are predominantly small farms of an average of plus or minus 100 acres and it has always been the case that the farmers could never justify purchasing machinery that would only be used for a short period of time through the year. Years ago, the only equipment a moorland farmer would have of his own were a tractor, plough and the basic cultivation machinery and would use the local contractor for the seasonal work like hedgetrimming, silage making, baling hay and straw and combining. Some farmers would, if they had a bigger area of land have have more kit and the adjoining farmers would pool their machinery together and would help each other at certain times. There are quite a number of farmer/contractors in opration in the area so the competition is rather fierce and this goes back to the point about the justification of expensive machinery, with machinery prices as they are at present, any farmers that need a big tractor or baler, forager, combine etc, contract themselves out to earn some money to offset the expence, so it's a vicious circle in a manner of speaking. The most common 'contracting' around me is hedgetrimming, around one farm in six has a hedgetrimmer and that one farmer will contract himself out in the winter months to the other five and trim their hedges. Another popular thing to do is for a couple of farmers to hire (self-drive) a machine such as a tractor and trimmer for a week or ten days and share the cost and do their hedges between them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gav836 Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 James you are a Norfolk translator now :D Whats Norfolk got to do with it : : Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james f Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 Whats Norfolk got to do with it : : Was that not our McMad friend's post I 'translated' there? He's from Norfolk as far as I remember, it used to be his reason in the old days, "Don't mind my spelling, I'm from Norfolk" or something to that effect :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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