Dutch contractors grass kit

[JohnP]

If it was a striaght balance between cost of manpower vs equipment then I can see the point. \

But there are so many other factors - heavier equipment hence damage to the land, can you get these things into the average field. I've heard of a farm with a 20' foot bed on their Lexion and most of the wheat came out of the back as the thing charged up and down - hardly efficient, is it !

Do some farm managers get sweet-talked into getting them or must they keep up with the Jones's  ???

[Guest Fendt pwr]

right then - daft question time

(prepare for a Numpty award ?)

I've often wondered about the huge bank loans that farmers must have for big items of kit that lay idle for 9-10 months of the year.

Is it really cost effective to have a these huge self-propelled forage harvesters & specialist trailers rather than towed bits of kit & standard trailers with side extensions ?  What sort of acreage do you need to make them pay ??

This goes for other big bits of equipment too; bigger and bigger Combines, potato harvesters etc. (my Dad is very opinionated about this).

This is also somthing I feel very strongly about,having run a farm already in life.

Owning just one big ticket iteam is like having a rope around your neck,if you work out the "true" cost of runing a tractor with a worker driving it,you get a huge fright.

[FB]

Good question John, I often think the same.

that does make the mind think FP , and thats a good question John  :)

Anyone care to fill us in? ???

[texas]

For the most farmers is a investment in tractors and implements a bad invesment. A tractor has to run about 500 hours each year will the invesment be profitable. So most farmers can beter call a contractor to do the job. But the farmers buy new tractors because wenn the have at the end off the year profit they have to pay tax and that they don't want. Also buy farmers new equipment or tractors because their neighbour has a new one. Contractors has to buy new equipment and big equipment because they are dependent on their equipment. And big equipment do the job faster and time is money. In the netherlands wenn you call a contractor for grass silage with a claasharvester ( or other harvester)it goes pro minut.

Texas

[JC]

That makes sense to me.

[Pingu]

There are some people that buy yhe kit just to keep up with other farmers

But when your covering large acres like 3000+ you need a large machine to cover it like the combine which is only used in that short period of harvest but having one large combine that is new and can handle it say in 30days, is better then running two or more older machines that will break down more often. To make money you need to have the right kit on an arable farm the combine is one of most important machines though only used for a few months a year so need large acres to cover the cost.

In relation to larger machines and compaction, tyre technologie has come on a long way since the 70's how many people back then even had 650mm wide tyres nowadays there as common as muck. Also people are noticing the compaction which is why tracked machines are getting more and more popular.

For a tractor to become a worthy buy along with driver, to buy a new macine you need to clock really 1000+hours a year with a 180+hp tractor just for it to cover it's cost any less and buy second-hand. Alot of contractors around running larger kit like Fendt 818's are clocking 2000+hours a year to cover there costs and keep the machines moving so dont loose any money.

Foragers are easyier to finance compared to combines as can be used from may until end of october in grass, whole crop and maize which is easily 700hours plus a year if managed right.

In modern farming it's all about being a manager and a buisness man you need to cover your cost first but look at everything compaction, hours need to make machine profitable, hours driver does, fuel and s on

[Guest Fendt pwr]

Well said MF-fan.

[Pingu]

Thanks wasnt even sure if it would make sense, i just try and write what i think should be done kind of  :D

[NCC]

Quite a few contractors round here have fancy new tractors, McCormick MTX's, NH TM's TSA's etc. Most are bought on finance so there not paying 40k, 50k in one lump sum instead there paying off little bits at a time throughout the year, to put it plain and simple.

I can't say as I like the idea of constantly owing money to someone or having the headache of having to find huge amounts of work to pay x amounts of money a month for a tractor. Instead I go and buy a decent 2nd hand tractor that I own, it might not have shiny paint and all the latest gadgets of a McCormick MTX but it's probably just as reliable, goes just as fast and gets the job done like the McCormick and most importantly I own it and I pull the strings.

I also bought a 2nd hand Kuhn GF 7601 8 rotor tedder last april for 4k, I knew I could get some work with it and planned it out that I it would of paid for its self within 2 years if I charged ?4 an acre for it. By June last year I had done something like 2000 acres with it. A hell of a lot more acres than I expected I would get and by the end of September last year I had covered about 3500 acres tedding out silage, haylage and hay. I'll let you do the maths as my tea is ready but the tedder paid for it's self near enough and I only had a 1 days worth of breakdowns. Down to a roll pin shearing on the digidrive on the last 2 rotors and a snapping a hinge/joint again on the end rotors. Doing 15k+ on unrolled fields is rather rough on it. It's all about planning really and exploiting the gaps in the contracting market near to you. You can only plan so much though as I managed to get 3000 acres more work last year than I bargained for and that was just tedding ;D

I hope that makes sense and reads right, the smell of tea cooking has got me in a spin :D :D

[Lord Ferguson]

Read well to me Nath... and a very shrewd businessman you are to boot ! - I take my hat off to you (if only I had one... but for now you just get a very blokey wink) 

[Powerstarâ„¢]

I'll let you do the maths as my tea is ready

  :D :D Excuse of the week

Sounds very sensible of you Nath, Marky you can take my hat off me and take it off to Nath if you get me then you give it back and i'll take it off to Nath :D

[JohnP]

I was going to reply earlier but the damn PC crashed !

Well, it wasn't such a numpty question after all !

Thanks for the interesting replies and views.

I guess it all boils down to what is best in each individual case. And the wage bill itself is such a big factor, especially compared to how things used to be and competition from Eastern Europe and the 3rd world.

But there was an item on the local news about farmers being hit by the lack of payouts from the EC subsidies....Now there's an even more controversial subject !

[NCC]

Read well to me Nath... and a very shrewd businessman you are to boot ! - I take my hat off to you (if only I had one... but for now you just get a very blokey wink) 

That will do then, but please don't wink again, I get all hot and flustered [ :D

  :D :D Excuse of the week

Sounds very sensible of you Nath, Marky you can take my hat off me and take it off to Nath if you get me then you give it back and i'll take it off to Nath :D

Cheers Luke, I was hungry, hadn't had any snap since 12.30pm :o :o :D

[Deere-est]

I like NCC's way, it's similar to my mate Pete's logic. He bought a yellow D1000 on a '90 or something. Ran it on a Ford 7810 on straw and a little hay for the first couple of years. Then when his name was popular he traded the tractor in for a late 8340sle with front linkage. The baler went next for a 5yr old Welgar D4000. Next came a 12t West rear discharge spreader and last week he took delivery of a 5000hr Preg 8360, shod on TM wheels and Pirelli tyres (he got that lot himself, part worns) and had a 3yr old 3t Chilton loader slapped on it. He has just turned 26. His uncles and Dad run a small outfit so he has bought what they don't have. The loader tractor will be hired by them when he doesn't need it, when he does they'll hire the 8340. If you can use a spanner, want to work and have a good insight to your customers needs then second hand kit is the best way.

To argue, a big contractor/farmer neesds to keep his staff. That requires investment in comfortable aswell as functional kit, hence all the Deere, CNH and AGCO's being seen. The beauty is that when the warranty runs out they trade it all in, that way their maintenace budget is figured out from day one.

Same with lorries, you have to please the driver as much as please your own pocket. Example, CRW hire subbies to pull their powder tankers. Most have brand spanking new wagons, one guy has a Scania Topline 6x2 tag lift. Stacks, alloy tanks; wheels; catwalk, marker poles, lightbars, airhorns, custom interior, chipped to 720hp .... all out price topped 100K. Next is Jim, runs a few lorries on the contract, the newest being a Treg Volvo FH12 420 6x2 midlift he bought ex-fleet for 12K. They both get paid the same rates!!!

[civilpek]

I don't understand way it is hard toget the grass out off the pit. Wenn they have problem toget it out off the pit it means the grass is very well packed. wenn a pit is good packed then you have a better quality grass to feed. Also the contractors overhere use loaders on the pit.

Texas

its easy to take grass from a chopper out of the pit as its precision choped so each blade of grass is only a few cm's long on the other hand the grass from the wagons is alot longer and therefore sticks together and gets tangled so that trying to cut it from the pit is very labourous and time consuming. we too use a loader on the pit and i assure you the guy loading for us is as good as anyone out there if not better, its actually a fact that my boss wins alot of his silage jobs done to the experience of the guy on our pit and hed be considered the most important guy in our fleet