Simon

Some home truths in there which sadly we must all admit to. I do everything I can to support British industry in work, I specify British manufactured furniture, floor coverings, wall coverings, joinery, paint, the lot... but when it comes to my hobby I fit it around whatever cash I have spare and sadly that means buying mass produced, which even more sadly means Chinese made..... We can't however magic up cash out of thin air but I'm confident that with closer pricing we would buy home produced models. In terms of the spectrum of models produced, it's bound to hit appreciating prices of rare models.... I have no need to buy a vintage Britains 135 or 595 or that sort of thing because I can buy a better detailed one off the shelf... There will always be collectors of older or rare models, but with mass market availability of something similar [and often better] the competitiveness over acquiring these rare pieces will be reduced....

Gonna be a big year I think, been a bit of a drought for blue ones and then my god haven't they all come at once!!

God John, you're so tight, and with all your money too

Busy day today, just having a sit down before I go replenish the wood for the fires.... changed the brake pads on Mrs H's car, managed to extricate myself from having to take the kids to a swimming party, god I hate them, swimming parties that is, not my kids, and then thought I ought to tackle sealing round the windows in the extension, been in 2 years now and the draughts are getting on my pip... All going well til I found I only had one tube of frame sealant, so tackled the insides instead with my flexible friend, gunnable decorators filler...

Yes, don't be too hasty chaps.... think Ros 180-90's being cut down to make 110-90's.... \

I know it's frustrating Noel but if Geoff has folded, it looks like he's doing his best to sort people out as fast as he can, and he'll be far more out of pocket than you. I don't know the value of your purchase, but look on the brightside, it's only money and it's not like it's hundreds, just tell yourself you went out on a really big bender and can't remember how much you spent!

So I guess the material cost for UH, producing thousands, is a small proportion of the unit sale price, and labour could be as little as pence per unit, the remainder of the revenue is taken up by R&D costs and profit. While you're up against a siginificantly higher material cost and the remainder going towards your labour, which has to include your R&D and margin.... I suppose the question we all want answered then Dave is - because if we had a simple choice of buying a UH for 40 quid or a DBP for [work with me here ] 50 quid, I think we'd probably all go with Dave's UK made model - how many units would you need to retail annually to allow you to get some economy of scale to reach this competitive pricing and improve your margins from where they are now? And perhaps more pertinently, how limited do you think your range of models would have to be?

Again, please clarify...

Too right, probably in his trousers

Good call, I'll have what he's having!

The frustrating or sad thing about all of this is that Dave, and Dave Towse, have been going out of their way to produce the models we want for years, and then UH tune into it and all of a sudden their market is turned on it's head.... I've lusted after a DBP anything for years and it's always been a 'one day' purchase, but now UH launch the 78 and all my Christmasses come at once, it's the variant I want a a price I can afford and, knowing UH, will be as accurate as I want it to be. What - apart from far eastern mass production - differentiates the production methods of DBP and UH...? Is it purely labour cost which sets DBP's prices [and UH et al] or are they manufactured in a completely different way...? Could DBP become a British UH and manufacture here and match UH prices [reasonably] closely, say £10 a unit on top? If this were the case I'd never buy a UH again..!

God here comes Marky being all 'right' again It did ramble OT, apologies, but it's always good to have a bit of background to a discussion I've been looking at the UH 7810 - a lot - this evening, and thinking how wonderful it is to finally have a decent production model, and what a tragedy that is for the likes of Dave Towse and Dave Purdue, and what a pain in the a*se it is for me with a load of Brian Norman bits for conversions..... 'tis a nice model though.... \ Sorry Daves, I know where my cash is going... \

Not at all Jo, quite the opposite of xenophobic in fact.... I think the rest of the world's cultures are wonderful and individual countries and customs are wonderful when they devlop into a unified and defined nation, and not in a 'nimby' fashion, in a we should celebrate our differences rather than try to integrate everything into some social and cultural mush.... I love to travel, but what's the point in travelling if you can pick up the food from Malaysia in the supermarket or try to decipher public information signs the native tongue of Estonia in your local Post Office... There's a reason that other countries don't want our cultures in theirs, because it's their country and they like it that way and they're entitled to, if you want to live in their countries then you do so on their terms. Why is it so wrong for anyone in this country to suggest the same for our little island... without the public floggings and so on of course.... This has all gone a bit OT, not a lot about fair trade models but some interesting stuff on fair trade itself, and it's supposed to be a balanced debate, not only are you entitled to your input but we need it, while we seem to be on opposite sides of the fence, there are still elements of your perspective which I agree with...

Likewise, construction industry.... aaah, the HSE, bless 'em!

There's an echo in here...! Are we twins?! Agree completely on Europe, it's time has been and gone, it has become an out of control self generating beurocracy... Our very own HSE for instance, is like a little micro-version of it, it becomes so autonomous that no one, even those who created it, can get control of it

Sean, I'm not sure even Madonna or Angeline Jolie would adopt you....

No wonder he's grumpy Mark, he must only have been up 10 minutes!!

The subject matter does little for me personally, but you gotta admit, they're stunning looking models

Exactly, football is a game.. like tiddlywinks, kiss chase and air hockey..... not a profession like heart surgery, rocket engineering or even bricklaying... how can tossing a ball up and down a field be worth 100 grand a week...?

Fiat 100-90 & terracotta NH 110-90 for me I think, starting to make up a very nice Herefordshire mixed farm fleet, what with the 7810 & 60 series.... cor, it's all coming right for me this year!!!

Apart from the previously mentioned exhaust & pre-cleaner bowl which should indeed be black, it's spot on, mirror arms, steps, the lot. We had a G plate gen III [G prefix registrations ran from September 1989 to Sept 90 for our foreign members] and it had blue steps and the black rubber rear mudguard extensions. Only difference between ours & this was we had no weight hanger, so I made up a 12" projection extension frame and hung JQ 40 / 50 series 35 or 40kg wafers on it... I, am one seriously deliriously happy blue lovin' bunny.... It's been a long time coming, 23 years I think, but worth the wait I think!

7878787878787878787878!!!!!!!!!!! God bless UH!!!

I won't be thinking of Britney Spears next time I'm on the nest that's for sure..... Can't wait to get my hands on a few of those...

You're right, but then US spec kit is secondary for the likes of UH, Wiking, Weise etc.... not that I'm a yankee sympathiser or anything

Now, apart from the fact that the front linkage is visually far superior, I would have placed money on that being a Siki.... If anyone from RC2 is reading this, give yourselves a pat on the back for the way it looks, this looks like the quality of toy which will give a whole new generation of future adults fond memories and loyalty to the Britains brand. For heaven's sake, keep it up!