Driving on the road with Agricultural vehicles. . . Whats the real rules??

[MODELFARMER]

Ok guys need some light in a very grey area, Nowadays 40k is the norm, 50k upandcoming fairly fast, but am I correct in saying that an agricultural vehicle must not exceed 20mph??

Does anyone know the true ifs, Buts, Do's and Don'ts???

Oh UK Related is where i'm talking about.

Even in new tractors there are stickers saying do not exceed 20mph, on my welger the same, kane dumper has a 30kph sticker, even the 3050 deere which is now 19yrs old has the 20mph sticker.

I heard it was because of no rear suspension, eg Fastrac not included, or is it because of braking systems? anyone know the answers??

Cause if it is true that 20mph is agri speed limits then the Police could have us all off the road in a space of a few flippin days!!

Ricky

[TM190]

on large vehicles such as tractors etc.. to exceed 20mph you must have air brakes I believe, which fastrac's do.. 

the amount of times we go told of a greenmount was unreal  :D

[CJ]

as far as im aware it because a fastrac has suspension on all 4 wheels which is why it is leagal to exceed 20mph

[ploughmaster]

That's correct:

The tractor and appliance/trailer it is towing must be fitted with full dual line air braking to legally exceed 20mph.  The air assisted hydraulic brakes found on some larger trailers is not sufficient. 

Both must also be fitted with independent suspension at each wheel (tractors fitted with a suspended front axle and cab do not meet the requirement). 

It is also important that the axles and wheels/tyres are suitable for high speed roadwork - those fitted to most standard agricultural spec trailers and appliances are not.

Fastracs and Unimogs can exceed 20mph legally because both have independent suspension and air braking as standard. 

Exceeding 20mph with a tractor not suitably equipped could potentially land you with a Fixed Penalty Notice and 3 points on your licence.  I have not heard of anyone who has actually suffered that though (although I do know of one case where a Fastrac operator was fined and received points for exceeding a 30mph limit)

The idea of the higher speed gearboxes, is to allow the operator to selct a higher gear and lower revs to aid ecomony and engine wear on road work, rather than to enable tractors to drive at high speed.   

[Rhysmassey135]

Bit of luck im not exceeding 20mph in my 135 then   

[powerrabbit]

Under the law an agricultural tractor is defined as 'a two axle rigid body vehicle that exceeds no more than 20mph'. This is the main criteria but other criteria comes under the law and certain things have been added into the law as time has gone on and tractors have evolved and got more sophisticated and faster. Tractors that are classed as agricultural vehicles, by the law, are now required to conform to the added criteria and incorporates the 'construction and use' legislation. I won't go into the detail as it has been previously mentioned but for instance, tractors that travel over 20mph must be fitted with an appropriate effective braking system as do any towed equipment that is itself, or carries over a certain weight.

[fergie 699]

is it not because apart from air a fastrac has the same braking system as a lorry ie hub as tractors don't

[Dwross]

If you want to get into the subject there are 2 books worth reading one by Andrew McMahon and the other by Mike Braithwaite. I think they are both called agricultural vehicles on the road.  Both have websites.

David

[Deere-est]

Interesting, David. Might take a look into that. Are they endorsed by any legal bodies?

[Lord Ferguson]

Bit of luck im not exceeding 20mph in my 135 then   

You what Rhys... is she not a 'Mutty Par' mate... me and Mavis are going for the land speed record next week  :D

Interesting comments...

Although..... I'd be happier taking my information from the authorities on a subject so complex and critical as this - perhaps Mike or Kev could enlighten us when they have the time... I believe that Gav told me one it's such a complex set of rules that some officers were more 'clued' than others (trained I guess I mean)... is that right Gav

I guess the fact is... unless an accident occurs most of us tractor owners/drivers/operators will get away with the odd 'bend' in the law (I know I know... you can't BEND the law... only break it).. what I am waffling on about is this... whilst I may break the law in doing 24.8mph (40k) on my tractor and 'get away with it' I would not drive about without adequate brakes on my equipment and expect not to be caught and punished.

Mind you... from a business owners perspective... if I am investing considerable sums of money in new plant it would be nice to know what I can and can't do with it legally before I make my buying decision... items such as GVW (Gross Vehicle Weight) would be useful to know... like most of us I 'THINK I KNOW' what I can and can't exceed... but it would be good to know the law 100% on this really  \

Example.. poor little Frankie... attached to my Bailey... fully loaded with soil... Maximum GVW in excess of 20mt... with the total limit being a little over 24t (I THINK)... it's pretty pointless in me getting a much bigger trailer or a bigger tractor as I'm not too far short of this with a 90hp machine and an 8.5t Bailey dumper trailer  \

[Gav836]

Thats right Marky, well at least in this area and from mine and other peoples experience (I was asked by an officer to produce the MOT certificate and the HGV licence I needed to drive the tractor after someone tried to overtake me as I was turning right with obvious results, Pug 206 was a mess) Even by the authorities own admission the laws need clarifying which I was told is why Andy McMahon's second book is so long coming. I was told that Andy was an officer in this area when he was serving and the farmers dreaded coming onto his patch as what he doesn't know on the subject isn't worth knowing

The weights inparticular need looking at as with the average sized tractor being bigger now and weighing in at 7-8t and a 14t trailer weighing 4-5t it means that loaded you are over the limit before you even start. Case to point out that the Renault 836 and 14t Western silage trailer I had tipped the scales at 15t empty and 32t loaded on maize, no way round it

[robbo]

I am in work this afternoon so I will have a look at the Police National Legal Database, however I do think that most of the posts so far are correct.

Andy McMahon is an ex Police officer who is now a specialist on the law relating to Agricultural vehicles on the road, he sometimes posts on forums as "AndyMcTractor". His website is below but doesn't contain much except for how to contact him. \ \ \

http://agricultural-vehicles.co.uk/agricultural-vehicles/index.htm

[Deere-est]

A clearer definition of the law, licence categories for different machines, diesel usage changes, road funding, operators licences and annual vehicle tests won't come soon enough in my opinion. It's about time farm vehicles were treated as traffic and transport/goods vehicles. It would be to everyones benefit.

As it is, the whole job is quite irresponsible and ignorant of the situation. The whole system needs sharpening up and modernising.

My Scania Topline 6x2 with triaxle flat and roll along crane weighed that, Gav! When you compare agricultural to commercial it's easy to forget how easy farmers and contractors have it. Aswell as how dangerous somebody with very little driving experience could be at the wheel of a 30t+ vehicle. \

[nashmach]

A clearer definition of the law, licence categories for different machines, diesel usage changes, road funding, operators licences and annual vehicle tests won't come soon enough in my opinion. It's about time farm vehicles were treated as traffic and transport/goods vehicles. It would be to everyones benefit.

As it is, the whole job is quite irresponsible and ignorant of the situation. The whole system needs sharpening up and modernising.

My Scania Topline 6x2 with triaxle flat and roll along crane weighed that, Gav! When you compare agricultural to commercial it's easy to forget how easy farmers and contractors have it. Aswell as how dangerous somebody with very little driving experience could be at the wheel of a 30t+ vehicle. \

And could therotically be only 16 when doing it  :'(

[Lord Ferguson]

Am I right in saying the age to drive a combine was 21 though... or was that just 'company policy' where I worked

[powerrabbit]

I believe you're right on the combine one Marky and I also believe in addition, to drive a combine on the road you must have had a 'full' license for three years. Just out of interest, you can take your tractor test at 16 years of age but can drive a tractor on the road without having passed the test at 17 as long as you display 'L' plates but I think you have to pass your test within a given time period.

[Deere-est]

That is correct as far as I know aswell. Unsure as to whether it covers other large self propelled machines though or as to why a combine has the age restriction, width?

[Deere-est]

I believe you're right on the combine one Marky and I also believe in addition, to drive a combine on the road you must have had a 'full' license for three years. Just out of interest, you can take your tractor test at 16 years of age but can drive a tractor on the road without having passed the test at 17 as long as you display 'L' plates but I think you have to pass your test within a given time period.

And as far as I know, having past your tractor test at 16 on a provisional licence you may only tow a close coupled trailer (ie, not dolly/turntable). Not sure if you are even permitted to carry a mounted implement. This licence also gives you a trailer licence up to 750kgs when you pass you (car) driving test. Or at least it did!

[1/32 farmer]

i think theres a weight limit your not allowed to drive over 7.5 tonnes dont know if its been lowered due to the change in lincense????? as you now need to take a test to drive a 7.5 tonne truck

i was not allowed to drive the 3cx on the road till i was 21 (few years ago that was ) because it was over 7.5tonnes

[Lord Ferguson]

Ah... that would make sense Stevie...

So.. Barry in a Smart Car would techinically be over 7.5t then  :D

[archbarch]

As far as i understood the 21yrs of age for driving a combine was for insurance purposes only

Strictly speaking the Unimog is more road legal than a Fastrac due to its breaking system, tacho especially when moving a digger etc by trailer.

MB Tracs were restricted on speed due to only having front suspension

i think the 15t weight limit still applies which is often broken along with the hauling of produce over a certain mileage

and as far as i know it is illegal to tow a trailer behind a telescopic loader or forklift on the road even though theyre fitted with hitches, lights etc

in my opinion if a tractor goes over 30kph then should fall into the same laws and regulations as the haulage industry it is wrong that someone can jump on a Fastrac and work all day 7 days a week with no enforced breaks or driving hours

[Stuarty C]

most of this stuff will be made clearer to me when i go to college next year but, i do know that driving a telehandler is illegal unless you hold a full driving license, i only have a provisional so technically im braking the law \

[powerrabbit]

On a full driving license which has the catagory 'F' listed as 'vehicles permitted to drive' on your licence which is the 'agricultural and forestry' catagory you are permitted to drive any other vehicle up to the gross weight of 7.50tonnes. Any weight over that you need to pass another test. The licence also allows you to drive any motor vehicle towing a trailer up to a weight, including vehicle, trailer and load (MAM - maximum allowed mass) of 7.50tonnes and now a seperate test is required in order to tow. Those of us that passed our test before 2002 are still allowed to tow a trailer with a MAM of 8.50tonnes. A towing weight of over 4tonnes requires the vehicle to be fitted with 'coupled' brakes, which by definition is either hydraulicly or air operated brakes. A trailer with a drawbar weight up to 750kgs does not require a braking system but trailers with a drawbar weight above this do. Drawbar weight is the measured downward weight of the towed trailer that is exerted on the vehicles towbar.

You still see agricultural machinery being towed on the roads, like balers, by Land Rovers and other trucks but this is illegal as the tyres fitted to them are not speed rated.

[Tractorman810]

i think theres a weight limit your not allowed to drive over 7.5 tonnes dont know if its been lowered due to the change in lincense????? as you now need to take a test to drive a 7.5 tonne truck

i was not allowed to drive the 3cx on the road till i was 21 (few years ago that was ) because it was over 7.5tonnes

pretty sure its before 2000? or there abouts when you can drive anything up to 7.5 tons and tow to, the license will have c1+e for that bit, plus the lorry logo,

after this date its all different, tractors trailers vans ect are all different tetse to add to the license, know that as the guy i work with had to sit a van test for work, as his license was car only, cant tow any trailer, no tractor logo on it, no lorry ect

[Deere-est]

 

The haulage industry is another example of bending of the rules  ...

40 Mph on single carriageways  ,   when was the last time you saw that    , I just followed a Scania & Ejector trailer full of rubbish , I was doing 60 ( in my car  ) & it was pulling  away from me .

The law needs updated in a lot of areas concerning traffic rules & regs  ,  this  is one that needs looking at  along with others previouslty mentioned .

There, that's better!  That 40mph rule is absoloutley ridiculous, it causes more trouble than it's worth and it still doesn't stop other vehicles crashing into lorries.