War Time Farm.

[powerrabbit]

New series starting now 8.00pm BBC2.

[WillTEF20]

Just watched it I thought it was very interesting and learnt more watching it than in my history lessons!!

[Paul Palmer]

very good programe,still another 7 episodes to watch

[powerrabbit]

They didn't quite get the mole drainer right and I don't think it takes quite 9 months for a field of wheat from drilling to harvest. But then, we that know always look at these sort of programmes in a critical way. Super programme, will look forward to watching the rest of the series. Oh, and I didn't think the Feild Marshall and Fordson E27N came out until around 1947 did they?

[dm434]

yeah i wondered too about the fordson E27N being around before the start of the war

[BC]

I didn't see the program but I think the E27N aka "the high major" first came out in 1948 but may well have been before that Tim and I think they were on really narrow rear tyres. I'm not so sure on the Field Marshall Series 1 aka " the Pom Pom" but it was certainly around the same era as you were talking about. For wartime the Marshall M would have been a more appropriate one to use for the filming. Must remember to watch the remaining episodes.

Edited September 8, 2012 by BC

[Leakeyvale]

They didn't quite get the mole drainer right and I don't think it takes quite 9 months for a field of wheat from drilling to harvest. But then, we that know always look at these sort of programmes in a critical way. Super programme, will look forward to watching the rest of the series. Oh, and I didn't think the Feild Marshall and Fordson E27N came out until around 1947 did they?

As far as I know they both arrived after the war - 1945 and 1948 respectively - but you have to allow a degree of poetic licence as there are very few pre-war tractors that are still in full working condition and whose owners will allow them to be used.

I enjoyed the program and am looking forward to the next episode. It makes history come alive although I remember staying with my godmother on her fathers farm in the fifties - no electric, no running water and no sewers either! Oil lamps, well and thunderboxes were the order of the day and I loved it (not the thunderboxes though)

Edited September 7, 2012 by Leakeyvale

[powerrabbit]

I remember those times as well Sue. The very early 1950's were still a time of austerity, if that's the right word, my closest farming relations, one family in particular, had no mains electric, pumped their water from a well in the yard, the overflow from the well ran into a great big grannite trough in the yard behind the house in which they immersed the milk churns every day to cool the milk. The main toilet was in a stone outhouse across the yard, it had a rough plank with 2 holes in it over the top of a deep pit that was periodically cleaned out with a shovel from behind the s***t house by hand. The only home entertainment was the battery radio on the long kitchen table. In the winter the big open hearth fire in the kitchen when lit was so full of smoke you could hardly breath or look through it. Water was heated and washing of clothes was done in the back scullery in a wood fired 'copper'. There was also a long narrow room integrated along the last 3/4 length of the house that had just a small window that had a sheet of perforated zinc in the frame instead of glass, in this room all the food products were kept and stored, it was known as 'the dairy', this room was so cold, even in the height of the good summers we used to have that as soon as you entered the cold air would hit you and if you stayed in there for more than 5 minutes your teeth would start to chatter. Oh, those were the days.

[Leakeyvale]

Every house had a larder with the perforated zinc window and they needed to be cold as fridges and freezers were not common and without electricity impossible to run. Larders were extremely efficient. I miss having one as the larder in my house was removed by previous owners!

The "proper" dairy at the farm I used to visit was cold too. Tim. It was a good three feet down to the floor level, faced north with the cow shed behind which meant it was extremely cold and also sterile. It meant a fairly long walk with the milk twice a day as both buildings were set in the middle of a long range. Mrs Deacon used to bring buckets of near-boiling water from the house (heated on the coal range) and throw the contents all over the dairy surfaces - shelves (granite) and floor. Within seconds it would be cold water. Everything was then scrubbed down, Huge enamelled bowls for the milk to settle were sterilised as were the dairy enamel buckets.

Milking was done by hand into other sterile buckets but the milk was transferred into the dairy buckets by pouring it through muslin. She churned butter by hand and the finished pats were wrapped in greaseproof paper and muslin, put in the bottom of another sterile pail and lowered down the well to harden before being carted off to the market. That well was deep and I remember my uncle holding me over it to see if I could see the bottom. That was enough for me NEVER to go near the well.

The thunderboxes there were single "holers" and had galvanised buckets underneath rather than a pit and which were emptied somewhere. I never knew quite where but I suspect there was a trench in the market garden area that would have been filled and then planted over. Nothing was ever wasted! I have been in a "water closet" where the seats were over a sloping cement ramp and a bucket of water was provided to pour down the hole afterwards. That one was in North Yorkshire back in the seventies!

Those were the days!

[powerrabbit]

I was always told Sue, and especially true in the case of my relatives farm, that wherever there was tomato plants growing on a heap of 'dung ", that"s where the contents of the toilet was dumped. Remember it well in the summer when my Aunt would send her little boy upthe field to pick the ripe tomatoes. Boy were they good, big, ripe and full of flavour!

[Leakeyvale]

Mmmmmmmmmmmm I can just taste them. Lots of nitrogen!

My grandfather always moved his rhubarb to the hole where the compost heap had been for the same reason. Delicious.

[powerrabbit]

And in keeping with the original theme of the topic, everyone who had the room and some sort of shelter kept at least one pig in their back garden during the last War and their 'waste' was then used on the garden to grow all their veg. It's a well known fact that the internals of a pig is very close to that of a human so no-one should baulk at eating produce fertalised by either sort. Mind you, you do have to leave the heap to mature, no good using it 'fresh'!

[Leakeyvale]

I have a septic tank as there are no mains sewers in our village. My roses are superb! So little has changed in rural areas.

I do not keep a pig though as I am afraid it would end up as a pet! But people were encouraged to be self-sufficient. Town and city back gardens were dug over and planted with vegetables; and pigs and chickens were kept where space allowed. The one thing you were not allowed to do was to sell or barter your produce - that was black market and illegal. I think the next episode covers that aspect.

[powerrabbit]

The stories my Father used to tell about the goings on in the War, I wish that he had written it down, the way everyone clubbed together, especially in the rural areas, farming families used to help each other at harvest and other times, swap foodstuffs, how when they killed an animal that they had to have a lookout posted just in case the local Bobby happened to come along or more usually bung him a joint of meat or two. Poching was just a big an issue back then as it still is now, rabbits were a valuable food source and the land was thick with them but unscrupulous villagers and their long-dogs would go out in the fields at night with their long nets and virtually clear a farm of rabbits, my Father used to say that he'd eaten so many rabbits that he started growing fur! How things have changed, both in the cities and uot in the country, there is now very little sense of community, everyone keeps themselves to themselves and as for growing and producing their own food to a certain degree, they have'nt a clue.

[Leakeyvale]

I am fortunate to live in a village that still has that sense of community. I pass apples, pears, mulberries (when they ripen without rotting) to neighbours including the local pub. In return I am presented with beans, marrows, courgettes and recently, beetroot and onions. I used to get rabbits from the gamekeeper on the estate where I worked but it is amazing how many people shudder at the mere thought of eating rabbit. I have to make an admission at this point - the rabbits came from the warren on Watership Down where the warren was allowed to remain but the population was kept under control much to the gamekeepers annoyance.

The same goes for pheasants as my husband was a postman he often received a brace or two as a Christmas box. Many of his colleagues used to pass over pheasants to him because they did not know what to do with them. One Christmas I had 8 brace of pheasants hanging in the apple tree. A brace served as part of the Christmas dinner and the rest went in the freezer.

My mother and aunts used to relate stories of "bootleg" produce that would be passed around. My mother's wedding cake (she had a REAL cake and not a cardboard one as was normal for wartime) was the result of friends and neighbours donating the required ingredients with fresh cream and butter magically appearing on the back step the day before in sufficient quantities to ensure the wedding guests did not go hungry! (no guesses as to where that came from)

[powerrabbit]

I have my Grandmothers wartime diary and 'accounts' books from the early 1940's and also her recipe book, these make fascinating reading, in the diary it records the day to day working and jobs carried out on the farm, her 'accounts' record their sales, rabbits, eggs, potatoes etc and wages paid to the seasonal labour, expences such as 'new pair of boots', 'baccy', oil for lamps, cloth and material for her to make, mend and 'make do' clothing. A very interesting read and something I shall always keep.

I also have her shool work for the year 1901 when she was 8 years old.

[Leakeyvale]

What a treasure you have, Tim. That is something the historians would love to see and so would I.

"Make do and Mend" is how I was brought up. I am a magpie and never throw anything away that could be useful. I can't help it as it is part of me. I remember my mother turning sheets "side to middle" because buying new ones was out of the question. Clothes would be mended and sometimes two items too small would be taken apart and made into one. As a child I had petticoats made of silk from a damaged parachute and mother had a blouse of the same. The webbing from the parachute also got used to replace bag handles etc and oddly I still have a length of that in the needlework box!

[BC]

What started as reference to a TV program has really turned into what I have to say is one of the best topics I have read and made a small contribution to this year on FTF. I'm sure we all moan and groan about things like losing internet connections and no signal on our mobiles phones or battery running low on our digital camera's...... and I have to think we did not have the same kind of hardships as our grandparents and family before them really had.

Tim that diary of your grandmother really must mean a lot to you and your family...whatever you do don't lose or let it get destroyed. In fact I would go and buy a fire proof safe to keep it in if you have not already done that ;D

[powerrabbit]

It's all tucked safeley away Bill.

My Mother used to save odd bits of material as well Sue, I think most women of that generation did, material and cloth being not so cheap and plentiful, she used to purchase our working trousers all the same colour and when we wnt through the knees handling bales of hay and straw she used to cut sqares out of one worn out pair to use as patches to sow into the other pair. Sheets from the beds were cut up and hemmed around the edges to stop 'running' and were then used as dishcloths, dusters, polishing rags and hankerchiefs. Any old rather holey and worn out woolen jumpers were un-picked, the good yarn rolled up in balls and re-knitted up as wooly hats, gloves and boot socks and any short bits of wool was saved to darn socks with. I recall her sitting for hours knitting, darning, patching and even making her and my Sisters dresses and blouses from patterns out of 'Womans Weekly' in the 1960's.

[Leakeyvale]

Oh golly - I remember unravelling knitwear, too. And then spending hours winding it all into balls for re-use. By the age of 5 of I was good wool winder!

[powerrabbit]

So was I! Mother used to make me sit on a hard wooden chair with my arms up, about 2 foot apart and as she ran back the oild jumper, would wind it around my hands to make a 'skein' and then when she thought there was enough would then proceed, with my arms aching like hell, wind it off int balls, I don't miss that at all! I also remember vividly in the latter part of the winter, freezing with the cold, sitting in the shed with my Father sorting out the hessian sacks and cutting up the really bad ones and with a bagging needle and binder twine sowing the peices from the rough bags over the mouse and rat holes in the better ones ready for the next corn harvest, no such thing as grain bins or silo's back then, another tedious job, that was until 'Copydex' came about, used to get it in a gallon can, used that then on the repair of sacks.

[robbo]

I know that "Classic Tractor" magazine concentrates on the last 30 or so years but I think that your collection and memories would make a fascinating article and that many farming folk would be able to empathise with your family history as they would have similar memories even if they don't have the diaries to back it up.

Rory .......are you there.....??

[dm434]

its amazing how all these things are now lost . people dont seem to have time for others, clothes have to be fancy named brands- not hand me downs either. i remember my mam knitting school jumpers out of old ones too. kids all helped out , now they need x boxes or i pads to amuse their modern brain

[powerrabbit]

That's why so many kids today are so wishy-washy looking and have all these allergies, not enough outdoor life and food that's too clean! We never suffered allergies and always had a good colour to our skins, only had a bath every evening, not a shower 5 times a day, never had a day off school unless we were needed at home to work, the dog always licked the plate after mealtimes and then washed in the sink by hand, any leftovers from mealtimes were saved and used up that evening or next day, bubble and squeek for breakfast with fried egg, bread and fat bacon, anything else, including the bones were thrown in a big pot and boiled to death on the stove for at least 2 days for a good soup or if you made up some suet dumplings and dropped them in, a real good rib-sticking stew, now, if anything is left over or 'out of date' it's in the bin, we were brought up with the statement that 'if it hasn't started growing fur, then you can still eat it. There was no obesity like there is now, if you were a bit on the plump side or a bit chubby, it was your nature, not your diet, I never saw a fat farmer, not in that sense anyway, they were on the whole a very lean breed because they worked it off. Talking of fat bacon, a pig was never killed until it was at least 18 to 20 score in weight, (20 pounds to a score so work that out!) now thy're killed at 5 score, mere piglets! And every other part was used, as we say, the only part of a pig you can't use is its squeel. I could go on. I'm sure I will.

[Leakeyvale]

Food was never wasted BUT it was stored sensibly. Larders were cool and airy as that perforated zinc window allowed airr to circulate. <arble or pumice shelves were even colder, meats went into a meat safe which always stood on the floor and was often made of a clay-like material with a dished top. You poured cold water into the dish and the body absorbed the water. As the water evaporated it cooled the thing. Camping shops still sell small versions. (or did the last time I went into one) Food was not bought chilled - it was bought at ambient temperature, When refrigerators became the norm the cases of food poisoning rose dramatically as everyone thought the fridge would "keep food fresh" - they do not keep ifood fresh but slow down the natural process of decay and a fridge is a sealed environment with no air circulation. Basic biology tells you that still air breeds bacteria and mould spores love still air too.

I know farms that still have game larders - very airy places . Would you hang your pheasants in a fridge? I think not.

Back to wool - yes I too used to help skeining wool. The skein would be tied and washed then I too would hold the skeins while mother wound. We shared both tasks until my father made a skein holder of wood which was four arms on a central spindle. Saved a lot of arm ache and worked very efficiently!